Borderlands

[Styx]

10 bucks says the Siren dies first.

...I call Siren.

[princessmoon]

10 bucks says the Siren dies first.

...I call Siren.

Phasewalk--melee one hit kill.

Dude, final boss was... that's it? What now? 2nd playthrough? ~~~~~~~ hummmmmm

[Styx]

10 bucks says the Siren dies first.

...I call Siren.

Phasewalk--melee one hit kill.

Dude, final boss was... that's it? What now? 2nd playthrough? ~~~~~~~ hummmmmm

Yes, however, rebuttal-
Rocket launcher to the FACE = 1-hit kill.
And Sledge, too.

Then we move on to the THIRD playthrough!  What fun!  Level 50's for ALL!

[Bresslol]

I'm trying to put together a d20 campaign for this game. I should, in theory, have it ready by Kumori.

[Styx]

Oh, hells, yeah!

I would SO be there.

[DancingTofu]

Siren can actually stack the crap out of shield to become almost indestructible.  My roommate has 1750 shield and 900 health with Siren and it isn't even a very good shield.  The hunter is really the only class that's particularly vulnerable.

[TurboSaiyanJason]

I'm trying to put together a d20 campaign for this game. I should, in theory, have it ready by Kumori.

I wanna play it!!!
Soldier with Weapon Focus combat Rifle and Shotguns, yet I still love my incendiary sniper.
Although you would only have 4 classes that both male and female characters could have, (Male siren, female soldier etc.) there's also the upgrade packs that give you class archetypes.

I haven't played Borderlands in so long at my friend's house. I consider it the adventure version of call of duty. It uses roughly the same controls, but gives you space to go ANYwhere and shoot ANYthing with ANY weapon.

[Styx]

Oh, come on, can't we get BEYOND Thunderdome?

Oh, yeah, how many times do you get to use that joke, never, baby, never!

How would loot be determined, though?  Just a dice roll for each element?  That would be a lot...

[TurboSaiyanJason]

In the do-it-yourself dungeon in the D&D 3rd ed player's handbook, you determine what level of treasure is being guarded and how many monsters are guarding it. Then you roll three times, to determine if the treasure's are coins, works of art or gems, masterwork or magical items arms or armor.

In the case of Borderlands, most loot will be in the form of guns, shields, health kits, cash, ammo, grenades, grenade mods, and class mods. Red chests and silver chests contain guns and mods along with 4 ammo clips for the guns, and maybe 4 grenades, black chests just contain piles of ammo. Most guns and mods have a minimum level required to use them, and with higher level weapons comes higher accuracy, damage and fire rate.

Determining a gun's maker can also tell what qualities it has. One company only makes elemental weapons.

[The Cow]

god this game is amazing >.< uhm whos on psn? just finished my first playthrough, havent bothered getting it online yet...

[DancingTofu]

FPS is pretty legit on 360.  But I would agree that the most correct way to play an FPS would be a mouse/joystick/keyboard combo on a PC.  Not really an option for folks like me though.

[The Cow]

well.... my pc sux arse so when i have to choose between perma-lag and a ps3... thats an easy choice... elitist.

[TanisNikana]

Tofu, you can plug a mouse and keyboard into a 360, you know.

[DancingTofu]

But can you calibrate them to work properly with most games? :O

My general understanding of the 360 is that Microsoft designed it specifically so it wouldn't be compatible with 3rd party controllers, so I assumed that mice and keyboards would be included.

[The Cow]

So i've been wondering about the weapon proficiency levels, is there a max level? and if so what is it?

[DancingTofu]

50.

[The Cow]

for weapon proficiency too?

[Cyprus]

I have been eyeballing this game since release...just hate forking over $60 for games & then forking over another $30+ in downloadable content (hello $130 for Fallout 3 that was released later as Game of the Year edition  ). Waiting to use my edge card on a used copy that is $50 or less.

[DancingTofu]

That's how I generally am too.  Which is why I was really happy when MHFU was only $30 retail.  $30 for 400+ hours of gameplay?  YES PLEASE.

Granted, I've actually only put about 60 hours into it since I bought it in July (my hunting partner, ha~ma, got burnt out from MHF2 and MHP2G after about 700 hours and 4 different characters), but that's still a better hourly rate than I get out of most games.

Anyway, I don't really agree with the price of games these days, especially when the market is so oversaturated and considering that we're in a recession.  I personally can't afford to play most of the games I ought to without pirating them or borrowing them, and I really dislike pirating well-made games because, again, the market is oversaturated with BAD games.

[TanisNikana]

MHF2. <3

[Cyprus]

So sad but true DancingTofu...I always buy my games & movies used these days & wait until the price is a lot lower as well. There are tons of games out right now that I would like to buy but everytime I think I made up my mind to spend the money, I don't. I stand in the store looking at them in my hand for a while...then 99 times out of 100 I end up putting them down & leaving empty handed because I can't allow myself to spend that kind of money.

If anyone is still playing Borderlands when I finally pick up a copy, I would like to play some co-op!

[ha~ma]

2k+ hours on MH2 variants lol  (- somewhere around 1-300 sleeping?) (P2 F2 P2g F2G). I'll bring my memcard tomorrow anyway just in case to get in a couple of games.

[Bresslol]

I have been eyeballing this game since release...just hate forking over $60 for games & then forking over another $30+ in downloadable content (hello $130 for Fallout 3 that was released later as Game of the Year edition  ). Waiting to use my edge card on a used copy that is $50 or less.

I see your point, but let me tell you something.

This is the first FPS I've played the crap out of since the original Perfect Dark. I logged well over 150 hours on that game.

I've only one of the DLC packs, beat the game as the soldier, hit 50. Good times.

Then I started a new game as a Siren. I'm still loving this game. I've logged over 72 hours on this gam as of today. Most I've logged on a 360 game (including Fallout 3, Forza 2, and friggin Rock Band.)

Buy the damned game already.

[Cyprus]

$60 is still $60 lol...I will be waiting for a better price no matter how awsome it is. Very few PS3 games have I paid full price for...when you can get it used cheaper from GameStop, no point in full price anymore. Especially when you consider the fact that BlueRay discs are VERY hard to scratch & they won't take trade-ins that are. Plus, when you own your own home among other expenses...burning $60 in winter when hours are slow isn't a good idea lol.

[Bresslol]

I've gotten 72+ (3 days) worth of playtime out of the game. I assume you'll get about 30. I think $2/hr for a game is rather reasonable, and if you play it longer, like I have, It'll get you more mileage.

[Cyprus]

I don't have much time to sit & play games for long periods of time anymore...so it would take a while to justify the cost even with that logic lol.

[Styx]

Well, free DLC.  I've never bought anything online that I couldn't physically hold in my hand in my life!

[Cyprus]

DLc should be free...paying $60 is enough to have rights to that IMO.

[DancingTofu]

Paid DLC is the only reason games like Rock Band and Guitar Hero didn't completely fall flat.  That's like saying that expansions or limited edition material should be free.  The video game industry is priced by demand because the supply curve is elastic.

[Cyprus]

Yet they are still guilty of over-inflating costs...you can't tell me with all honesty that they aren't making insane amounts of money. Most of those people drive half-million dollar cars just for commute to work. Fine, charge for DLC, but charge $5 instead of $10 & don't sell the original for $60 or more...try $40 & see how many more people buy new games.

[The Cow]

Hey so not to ask the same question twice but does anyone know if the weapon proficiency has a level cap? i assume its 100 or some unattainable number that your never actually supposed to reach. Has anyone reached it?

[Cyprus]

Um... There's  a reason that these games cost $60 for XBox and $50 for PC. I don't know if you ever watched the credits for something like Borderland or Mass Effect, but it lists well over 400 people that worked on the game.

So lets take 400 people, 2 years, paying them $65,000 (which is low BTW) and you get $58,000,000. So yeah, games cost just a little to make.

Just like union worker in car facilities...OVERPAID

[DancingTofu]

Hey so not to ask the same question twice but does anyone know if the weapon proficiency has a level cap? i assume its 100 or some unattainable number that your never actually supposed to reach. Has anyone reached it?

It's 50...and the link I provided to GameFAQs.com when you asked earlier explicitly answers that exact question and required only a few seconds for me to find.

As for the pricing argument, Decreasing the price of a game by $20 will decrease the amount that the game nets as a total.  The licensing company (Sony, Microsoft, or Nintendo for any console game) will get the same amount per copy.  They net a profit.  The publisher (Sony, Nintendo, Konami, Sega, Atari, Midway, Ubisoft, et cetera) will get the same amount per copy.  The net a profit.  The developer (Bungie, Gearbox, Capcom, Bemani, Bethesda, Blizzard, Square Enix, RoXoR, et cetera) will receive an amount equal to n-(Ln)-(Pn)-(m+d), where n is the number of copies of the game sole, L is the licensing fee per game sold, P is the publishing fee per game sold, m is the manufacturing cost, and d is the development cost.  A lucky, successful developer will break even.  In other words, they'll be able to pay full development salaries without going bankrupt or laying off development staff, and they'll continue to produce more excellent games in the future.  The unlucky ones don't achieve a profit, and get purchased by their Publisher or Licensor.*

Increasing the cost of games allows development companies to make the best games and gives honest, hard-working people great jobs.  The price tag isn't pretty, but it's really not up to you to change.  Publishers and Licensors will continue to hold developers under their thumb as long as they can control the market.  That's why I'm a computer gamer.  It's easier for Developers to get games published and licensed for PC than for any major console because the hardware and firmware are so open-ended.  Don't want to pay $60 for Borderlands?  Get the PC version for $50, or cheaper used.  It's a better way to play and a larger percentage of your expenses will go towards supporting the developers.

* I'm not 100% sure this is exactly how the industry operates at the moment, but I'm very certain that my point still stands: a drop in price and increase in sales will generally net a profit for publishers and licensors and a deficit for developers.  I'm also intentionally leaving out retailers because retailers don't set a base price; they just sell games for whatever price best reflects the demand curve.

[Cyprus]

Um... There's  a reason that these games cost $60 for XBox and $50 for PC. I don't know if you ever watched the credits for something like Borderland or Mass Effect, but it lists well over 400 people that worked on the game.

So lets take 400 people, 2 years, paying them $65,000 (which is low BTW) and you get $58,000,000. So yeah, games cost just a little to make.

Just like union worker in car facilities...OVERPAID

I'm sorry, but $65,000 is low for the computer science industry. Base salary is usually around $80,000.

I'm sorry if you think this is unfair for some reason, but finding good computer scientists is hard. They devote pretty much the time from when they were born to their early 20s learning EVERYTHING they need to know about programming, data structures, etc. (I should know, I am one.) This usually involves at least a masters degree and most likely a doctorate.

We work hard to make that much. So quit your complaining and get a degree that will allow you to make that much if you want to.

Don't lecture me as if you know a single thing about my work or my life. I work my a** off every day & have been for more years than you could probably fathom.  I OWN MY HOUSE...MY CARS...MY PROPERTY. Where is your studio apt. located again? Or maybe its just the basement in mom's house? Don't patronize me. Think before you try to lecture people you don't know & keep your self-centered OPINION to yourself.

As for the cost...not a soul in this world can whole-heartedly say that inflation hasn't directly affected all of this.

[DancingTofu]

Inflation only represents numbers.  It does not represent value, so that's kind of a moot point.

[Bresslol]

Um... There's  a reason that these games cost $60 for XBox and $50 for PC. I don't know if you ever watched the credits for something like Borderland or Mass Effect, but it lists well over 400 people that worked on the game.

So lets take 400 people, 2 years, paying them $65,000 (which is low BTW) and you get $58,000,000. So yeah, games cost just a little to make.

Just like union worker in car facilities...OVERPAID

I take great offense to this.

I work in the industry (If you think I am lying, go ahead and look for my name in the Fable II credits). A lot of these games do cost a lot of money to make, to say that I for one, don't deserve to be paid and that a $60 price tag isn't fair is a slap in the face to my industry. You're basically saying that I can right screw off and get minimum wage for my hard (sometimes 100 hours a week) work to make sure that the game ships with as few bugs and issues as possible.

Also, not everyone lives with their parents. Your post attacking Tofu makes you look like a self-important person, and again, the rest of us can right screw off. Also, I'd like to point out something really quick:

Don't lecture me as if you know a single thing about my work or my life. I work my a** off every day & have been for more years than you could probably fathom.  I OWN MY HOUSE...MY CARS...MY PROPERTY. Where is your studio apt. located again? Or maybe its just the basement in mom's house? Don't patronize me. Think before you try to lecture people you don't know & keep your self-centered OPINION to yourself.

I've bolded those two things to point out your hypocrisy. You're saying not to assume your life or work, and then you go off and assume other people's. Just saying. Not everyone here is a stereotypical gamer, and you really have no right assuming everyone in this thread is.


I will also point out to you quite a few games on the SNES ran for $70, and people still bought them; people will pay money for something if they really want it, and moreson if they are going to get quite a bit of playtime out of it.

[DancingTofu]

I don't really disagree with having this discussion, but it may be necessary to start a new topic for it so this thread doesn't get jacked.  Any takers?  I can try to split it but it wouldn't be a clean split.

[DancingTofu]

I couldn't find a good split point.  Please use this thread to continue this discussion, and everyone remember to please be civil and open-minded when sharing your thoughts.