Banned Costumes/Cosplay?

[ZombieFace]

As has been said before.  Since this cosplayer decided to push the issue, clearer rules will need to be made. 

Firstly, thank you for unlocking the thread. It's obvious that clearer rules do need to be made.
Secondly, I wore my costume with the intent to have fun and such.  I proudly wore it under the assumption that if people from the con had an issue, they would assign a yojimbo or tell me to only wear it to the 18+ panels, or after minors were no longer permitted.. Instead i was told to "remove my costume or the police would be called".

I fully support the decision of Kumoricon in the sense that they have the right to tell whoever what not to wear on convention space.  But it is a slippery slope if you don't allow a bear costume with pervasive undertones, what else is not allowed.  That is why I started this thread, because I believe I am not alone in wanting to know.

I am very displeased with how the staff handled the matter. That is my main beef.  It is a costume of a popular internet meme that should be joked about. I will quote Teuvan on the most awesome advice I have heard in a long, long time. "I firmly believe that everything should be joked about."

Please note that I have all the communications between myself and the staff and have also recorded conversations on camera with people about these events. I just want to know what is allowed and not allowed at Kumoricon.

So far it's:

Banned
1. PedoBear
2. Nyuu (Lucy) from Elfen Lied



I miss any? Please continue on with this list if so.  Also, if you wish to discuss these issues talked about in depth with me, please send me an email, I will gladly discuss it there. Let's keep this thread on topic as much as we can. XD  I posted my costume that was banned, hope that's okay.

[valliegirl]

Secondly, I wore my costume with the intent to have fun and such.  I proudly wore it under the assumption that if people from the con had an issue, they would assign a yojimbo or tell me to only wear it to the 18+ panels, or after minors were no longer permitted.. Instead i was told to "remove my costume or the police would be called".

Ok, there's something I want to add to this because it has been bothering me.  The day you were wearing the costume, which I assume was Saturday (all the days are just blurring together for me), a person in your group came up to me at info desk to complain.  This person stated that you were being given a hard time by Yojimbo for being "pedobear" when really you weren't here with the intention of being "pedobear".  Your costume was a real character from a real anime, and he listed it, but I don't remember exactly what was referenced.  I pointed this individual to the Yojimbo office, because this issue was not something I had power over.

But you were pedobear.  You knew what you were doing, and you knew people might take issue with it.  And when stuff started hitting the fan, people with you started lying to members of staff in an effort to convince us to not have your costume banned.

When you wear a risky cosplay or premeditate to do something that people at the convention may take issue with, BE PREPARED FOR THE CONSEQUENCES. 

So, take this and learn from it, and know that those on the board definitely will as well.

[ZombieFace]

Secondly, I wore my costume with the intent to have fun and such.  I proudly wore it under the assumption that if people from the con had an issue, they would assign a yojimbo or tell me to only wear it to the 18+ panels, or after minors were no longer permitted.. Instead i was told to "remove my costume or the police would be called".

Ok, there's something I want to add to this because it has been bothering me.  The day you were wearing the costume, which I assume was Saturday (all the days are just blurring together for me), a person in your group came up to me at info desk to complain.  This person stated that you were being given a hard time by Yojimbo for being "pedobear" when really you weren't here with the intention of being "pedobear".  Your costume was a real character from a real anime, and he listed it, but I don't remember exactly what was referenced.  I pointed this individual to the Yojimbo office, because this issue was not something I had power over.

But you were pedobear.  You knew what you were doing, and you knew people might take issue with it.  And when stuff started hitting the fan, people with you started lying to members of staff in an effort to convince us to not have your costume banned.

When you wear a risky cosplay or premeditate to do something that people at the convention may take issue with, BE PREPARED FOR THE CONSEQUENCES. 

So, take this and learn from it, and know that those on the board definitely will as well.

XD

this is funny to me because nobody did this "in my group".  In actuality, I was staying on the 7th floor. and AFTER being banned.. maybe an hour or 2 later.. My girlfriend and I rode up the elevators in normal clothes.. and saw the cosplayer in question about ready to ride down.  I said, "PEDOBEAR!" and he gave a 2 thumbs up.. then I said "You better watch it dude, I wore the same costume and they banned me 15minutes from hitting the bottom floor." He shrugged and entered the elevator.. his company he had with him were shocked when I said I was banned.  He had a PedoBear seal of approval with him as well..

After that, my girlfriend and I joked because we envisioned the yojimbos tackling him and beating the crap out of him saying, "WE TOLD YOU ALREADY TO NOT WEAR THAT COSPLAY!"   ...assuming it was me.  ...like you did.

So, no. That was not me. The only group I had with me was my girlfriend and we talked to the head of security for the hotel as well as the program director and 2 other yojimbos.

But thank you for assuming. I don't even know of any bears that look like pedobear from anime.. except the lactating teddy bears from Akira. XD

Sidenote: The hotel staff were very polite! They seemed to enjoy the con goers.

[valliegirl]

Alright, I apologize, there was apparently more than one incident.

[ZombieFace]

Alright, I apologize, there was apparently more than one incident.

Thank you for apologizing.

I can understand the confusion.  That would be like me saying, "That Kairi from Kingdom Hearts came up and called me a name!"  ...and then me trying to describe which one. XD

[Hawkeye]

this is funny to me because nobody did this "in my group".  In actuality, I was staying on the 7th floor. and AFTER being banned.. maybe an hour or 2 later.. My girlfriend and I rode up the elevators in normal clothes.. and saw the cosplayer in question about ready to ride down.  I said, "PEDOBEAR!" and he gave a 2 thumbs up.. then I said "You better watch it dude, I wore the same costume and they banned me 15minutes from hitting the bottom floor." He shrugged and entered the elevator.. his company he had with him were shocked when I said I was banned.  He had a PedoBear seal of approval with him as well.

Please understand one thing with the PedoBear issue at hand.  We (meaning the staff and moderators) had clearly stated that ANYONE wearing the PedoBear costume or anything that could be taken as PedoBear would be instructed to remove it via the forums.  We had trained the yojimbo to recognize this issue as stated to us by the directors.  I apologize if any of the squad were particularly rude about how they handled it, but we did have our orders.  Blackjack, remember one thing.  PedoBear may be a supposed "Internet Geek" kind of reference, but 90% of our convention is internet geeks.  Therefore we cannot condone PedoBear in any way, shape, or form out of risk of angering our many attendees.  Let this be an end to the discussion please for all involved, it is starting to get out of hand again.

[ZombieFace]

  Let this be an end to the discussion please for all involved, it is starting to get out of hand again.

Yes, I would like to delve further into the controversial outfits.. and my feelings aside, I think we have been informed well enough that PedoBear was banned..  Do you know of any other cosplay that was under the watchful eye of the staff? Size issues? Lack of clothing? Too risque? Is gore ever a factor that may result in a ban?

[Hawkeye]

  Let this be an end to the discussion please for all involved, it is starting to get out of hand again.

Yes, I would like to delve further into the controversial outfits.. and my feelings aside, I think we have been informed well enough that PedoBear was banned..  Do you know of any other cosplay that was under the watchful eye of the staff? Size issues? Lack of clothing? Too risque? Is gore ever a factor that may result in a ban?

We did have a couple of female cosplays that had to be looked over by me (as the high-ranking female yojimbo) to determine decency standards and were found to be just fine.  Gore can play into a decision if there is enough complaints about the costume in question, but as of yet there have been no bans of gory cosplay to my knowledge.

[Deviant Spider]

In all honesty many costumes could potentially be banned if people were to complain about them. If a convention attendee were to feel uncomfortable about a costume for reasons such as religion, race, etc. (example the Natzi costume) than that cosplayer would be asked to change. At this convention we want our guests to have fun and feel safe. Pedo bear made many people feel uncomfortable so it was banned. I know Hawkeye is watching this so am I correct in assuming that if someone complained about a costume because they did not feel safe or comfortable around the concept that we would ask them to change?

[Rathany]

As I explained above, we had been getting harrasing emails from a congoer planning to dress as pedobead.  He had given us much reason to assume he was going to cause problems.  If you are not the one who was sending harrassing emails to the board, please understand that you exactly fit the description of someone who was intending to cause the sorts of problems that we cannot allow at our convention. 

If not for this other person, things would have played out differently.  Yojis has been breifed to look out for someone fitting your description and to get them out of con space before they cause problems. 

It sounds like you got caught in the middle of this situation a bit, and I am sorry for that.

I udnerstand the thought that everything should be joked about.  You should see the shock on people's faces for the way we joke about my friend's traumatic brain injury and partial lobectomy.  Just because people joke about it does not mean they realize that it is serious.  My friend would have half a mind to tell you herself.  However, there is an issue of appropriate time and place.  After some forum posts we got alot of feedback via emails, personal messages, and even some phone calls from people saying this this cosplay would make them deeply uncomfortable and upset. 

[eta]
The friend in question is fully mentally capable and instigates all this.  Sorry, I forget that some people might think I was talking about making fun of someone.  I have gotten very used to the idea that people can walk around missing 1/4 or 1/2 of thier brain and be ok.  She is a volunteer with the con. 

[XFD]

we joke about my friend's traumatic brain injury and partial lobectomy.  Just because people joke about it does not mean they realize that it is serious.  My friend would have half a mind to tell you herself.

Was this a pun fatality?!

[MistressLegato]

I don't believe that anyone can honestly be of the belief that pedobear should be allowed because "only internet geeks know about it."  I knew about pedobear from friends before I knew what 4chan was.

I also wouldn't be comfortable taking my nephews to a con with pedobears (even though, I personally would get my picture taken with him for the lulz).

I don't know why Nyuu broke the roles because when I saw her her bandages covered everything the was necessary in the booklet, but I suppose the bandages may have slipped!

I'm curious to know about the nude suit, since we're figuring out what is banned versus acceptable.  I remember a girl cosplaying as a "nude" Eternal Sailor Moon and was told to change out of the costume because it was unacceptable, even though it was a full suit.

[kurosakiichigo666]

I just want to give my opinion on the whole Nazi thing. As someone who comes from a strong Jewish background, I would be EXTREMELY offended if ANYONE cosplayed as a Nazi. The only exception for me would be if they were from Hellsing or something, but only because I like that anime, but even then I would still be a little put off. But I would definitely say something to someone if anybody cosplayed as a straight-up, non-anime Nazi.

[MistressLegato]

I just want to give my opinion on the whole Nazi thing. As someone who comes from a strong Jewish background, I would be EXTREMELY offended if ANYONE cosplayed as a Nazi. The only exception for me would be if they were from Hellsing or something, but only because I like that anime, but even then I would still be a little put off. But I would definitely say something to someone if anybody cosplayed as a straight-up, non-anime Nazi.

I SECOND this.  The anime Nazi thing still weirds me out, too.

[EveofAbyss]

I think that upon the rare instance that someone cosplays a Nazi character, they aren't doing it because that person is a Nazi, they are doing it because they relate to some other aspect of the character, or like the character. I'd hope anyway that there were no neo-Nazi cosplayers around this year, or ever. I saw the cosplayer in question on the last day and, honestly, was not surprised. I have seen enough WWII era anime for me to immediately understand the costume's presence, but it still has to be held to the same standard as every other costume. If an outsider were to see someone dressed as a Nazi, there would be no second glances, double takes or chances for a formal introduction. The con would already have the negative connotations and assumptions related to Nazi beliefs, most likely.

[ZombieFace]

As someone who comes from a strong Jewish background, I would be EXTREMELY offended if ANYONE cosplayed as a Nazi. The only exception for me would be if they were from Hellsing or something, but only because I like that anime

When it comes to definie what is acceptable and unacceptable it seems that the views of patrons involved only construes things even further.  
I can see why that would offend you.. but 'if t were from Hellsing' making it okay makes no sense.  The staff at Kumoricon can not say, "Well, SOMEBODY may find this offensive so let's not allow it."  
Because like I said in the beginning, this is a slippery slope.. My main example when being told it was unacceptable was that I also cosplayed Pyramid Head.. and he is a Murdering Rapist... Yet widely accepted. Pyramid Head always know what time it is.
I know the KCon staff have some very tough choices and I'm sure some of their choices and bullying is not of their own will. I know that nearly every time somebody confronted me about the PedoBear costume, there was another staff member apologizing because they felt it was a bit silly.
I wish we could have photos of the banned costumes. that would really sum things up.. i bet that would also cause problems because people would find similiar cosplay afrom the con and say, "well, you accepted this one"

[EveofAbyss]

^ The photos are a good idea. Like, I know Pedobear, but I looked up pictures of Nyuu/Lucy and couldn't find anything that looked even remotely problematic. So, was it an alternate outfit or something? I don't know anything about the show.

[MistressLegato]

There were also some Bible Black cosplays and that is deemed as okay, despite being from a hentai.

The whole, trying to follow PG-13 rules is kind of problematic . . . I can see where staff would have a lot of trouble deciding why to allow Pyramid Head (woot!) and not allowing other things.

[shademalek]

^ The photos are a good idea. Like, I know Pedobear, but I looked up pictures of Nyuu/Lucy and couldn't find anything that looked even remotely problematic. So, was it an alternate outfit or something? I don't know anything about the show.

Was that really banned? I thought they just made her check her bandages and make sure everything was coverred due to some slippage. This is all hearsay mind you. =P

[Deviant Spider]

^ The photos are a good idea. Like, I know Pedobear, but I looked up pictures of Nyuu/Lucy and couldn't find anything that looked even remotely problematic. So, was it an alternate outfit or something? I don't know anything about the show.

one of the more popular cosplays of nyuu are of a naked girl just wrapped in bandages covering her body stratigically. the problem was that our convention wants 60% of your body covered and her bandages could have been transparent or not enough in general.

[ZombieFace]

I love Elfen Lied and am *__* when I see a Nyuu.. Here is one of my favorites.

[kurosakiichigo666]

As someone who comes from a strong Jewish background, I would be EXTREMELY offended if ANYONE cosplayed as a Nazi. The only exception for me would be if they were from Hellsing or something, but only because I like that anime

When it comes to definie what is acceptable and unacceptable it seems that the views of patrons involved only construes things even further. 
I can see why that would offend you.. but 'if t were from Hellsing' making it okay makes no sense.

I never said "if it were from Hellsing then it would be OK". If what I said implied that then I apologize, let me clarify. If it's a Nazi from Hellsing or some other anime with Nazis', then I would be less offended and put-off. Also, I wouldn't do anything about it since it's from an anime and Kumoricon is an anime convention after all. In fact, if it was a Hellsing Nazi, then I probably wouldn't care at all since the villians in Hellsing are almost as badass as the main characters and I can understand someone cosplaying as them. And it does make sense to think it's OK if it's from Hellsing because the reasons for the costume are different. If someone is cosplaying as Major Rip Van Winkle, then obviously the person thinks that character is totally boss, which I agree with, she is. However, if someone was cosplaying Hitler, then obviously they are either a Neo-Nazi, or they are doing it just to offend someone, and they would succeed spectacularly.

[Teuvan]

As someone who comes from a strong Jewish background, I would be EXTREMELY offended if ANYONE cosplayed as a Nazi. The only exception for me would be if they were from Hellsing or something, but only because I like that anime

When it comes to definie what is acceptable and unacceptable it seems that the views of patrons involved only construes things even further. 
I can see why that would offend you.. but 'if t were from Hellsing' making it okay makes no sense.

I never said "if it were from Hellsing then it would be OK". If what I said implied that then I apologize, let me clarify. If it's a Nazi from Hellsing or some other anime with Nazis', then I would be less offended and put-off. Also, I wouldn't do anything about it since it's from an anime and Kumoricon is an anime convention after all. In fact, if it was a Hellsing Nazi, then I probably wouldn't care at all since the villians in Hellsing are almost as badass as the main characters and I can understand someone cosplaying as them. And it does make sense to think it's OK if it's from Hellsing because the reasons for the costume are different. If someone is cosplaying as Major Rip Van Winkle, then obviously the person thinks that character is totally boss, which I agree with, she is. However, if someone was cosplaying Hitler, then obviously they are either a Neo-Nazi, or they are doing it just to offend someone, and they would succeed spectacularly.

Hitler's a legitimate anime/manga character. Take Osamu Tezuka's manga Adolf, for example.

I mean, who wouldn't want to cosplay this: http://img252.imageshack.us/my.php?image=1205115884718we3.png

Another awesome Nazi character: http://img181.imageshack.us/my.php?image=1198734461827ph9.gif

[kurosakiichigo666]

I don't care if Hitler is a legitimate anime character, it's still incredibly offensive and I doubt many people know about that anime/manga anyways. As for the other guy, .......bah why do I even try, I quit. Every time I say something someone is just gonna contradict me for arguments sake. You wanna cosplay as a Nazi, fine. But don't expect me to not say anything about it. I mean, my great-grandfather was in Auschwitz, and I'm sure at least one person staying in the hotel or just passing by was in WWII or had their lives greatly affected by it and would also be offended by seeing a Swastika on someone's chest, whether they're from Hellsing or not.

[~boogiepop~]

I don't care if Hitler is a legitimate anime character, it's still incredibly offensive and I doubt many people know about that anime/manga anyways. As for the other guy, .......bah why do I even try, I quit. Every time I say something someone is just gonna contradict me for arguments sake. You wanna cosplay as a Nazi, fine. But don't expect me to not say anything about it. I mean, my great-grandfather was in Auschwitz, and I'm sure at least one person staying in the hotel or just passing by was in WWII or had their lives greatly affected by it and would also be offended by seeing a Swastika on someone's chest, whether they're from Hellsing or not.

Sorry Sean that's how forums work. People just argue about everything D: I agree with what you say though. Even though I find most everything hilarious that would hit a point with me seeing as my Dad was born in one of the long lasting concentration camps and such.

[TanisNikana]

Godwin's law, much?

[Prinz Eugen]

A few loose pennies of thought on this topic.

ONE: Law enforcement, including FBI, may be reading this forum. They may be all over 4chan, too. The unfounded belief that "it's only an internet meme, and only the cool kidz who know it's a joke would recognize it" explains why morons who do stupid vandalism, film it with their camera phones, and post clips on their Myspace, then suddenly get surprised when folks with wallet badges visit them (or their parents) with uncomfortable questions or duly deserved charges to press. Kumoricon really doesn't need this sort of baggage.

TWO, relating to ONE: Back in the 80's a bunch of college students invented a game system called 'T.A.G' which stood for 'The Assassination Game.' A list of players would submit their class schedules to a game master who would pair off students for 'hits.' Using water pistols or other creative devices (an envelope with a taut elastic and a button, so that opening the envelope spun the button and made a buzzing sound - was a 'letter bomb,') to rub out players. The game master pared the players down and announced the final survivor. Cool fun, then players started painting their water pistols flat-black. NOT VERY COOL AT ALL when a player gets into the role, shouts "YOU'RE DEAD, SUCKER," at a campus bus stop, draws the realistic-looking water pistol ...

... and gets dropped by REAL bullets by an off-duty cop whose training takes over. This actually happened, and the popularity of 'T.A.G.' absolutely and instantly cratered. (Oh wait, they made a movie called 'Nikita.')

Now what's happening is that people who want to play with prop weapons (honest, innocent, above-board fun) color their props. What then happens is that creepy bent dirtbags spray paint their REAL, toy-looking Glocks in these same silly colors, so they can sneak them into a situation where everyone expects colorful non-functioning toys, and caps people FOR REAL. I'm just waiting for some nut case to bring in a real gun (stolen) to a paintball alley and start whacking out innocent players.

Morale of the story is that when law enforcement skims a forum board or a stream of IM chatter, and they read what *might* be a *credible threat,* they really HAVE to prepare and react. "It's only a joke" gets about as funny as time-bomb 'jokes' would be at the airport. Technically it should be free speech yes, but you gotta admit that that would be quite the bonehead manouver, and you couldn't really be 100% surprised if anyone who has to act as a community custodian (meaning law enforcement, hotel staff, etc) takes a 'joke' seriously. And then the party's really over, because people responsible cannot tell the difference between a joke, versus a very clever person trying to do something *for real* under the best possible cover: "It's only a joke!"

THREE: Just my humble opinion on the Nazi costumes. I didn't see any, but I did see a Jin-Roh character. I haven't seen Jin-Roh, so I would not attribute their Nazi-looking costumes with the evil goals of the actual Nazi party: racial stratification, eugenics, genocide, phrenology, and their weird distortion of Nordic legends to their own fanatic ends. Jin-Roh does equip their infantry with the German MG42 medium machinegun, 8mm x 1200 rd/min fire rate, which as a historical collectible is rather cool. Also why the few real ones available in this day are EXPENSIVE.

If I saw a Nazi costumer at an anime con with no other context, I'd reach and possibly remember URDA (Don't bother watching it - another just-my-opinion) but I'd also wonder whether that person was clueless enough to no know he might make people uneasy - especially people alive today who had uncles and grandparents who were gassed to death. Or shot.

Next, I'd think that the Nazi, when in the company of either a set of other people costumed as known baddies: Hitler among Fidel Castro, Josef Stalin, Pol Pot, etc. or a Waffen SS trooper in the company of peers and adversaries, such as a few Allied soldier cosplayers, Italians (Axis,) Austrians, etc. then the point would be to 'complete the set,' rather than to call attention to one (particularly objectionable) worldview, and in the context of a set, I'd find it less unsettling.

Oh well.

[BlackjackGabbiani]

Godwin's law, much?

Where do you keep getting this from? There are no COMPARASIONS to Nazis or facism any place in this thread, and THAT'S what Godwin's is. Not MENTIONING Nazis in a place where it's suitable to mention them!

Plus I'm sick of that "law" any way. Sometimes a comparasion *is* valid, and the other person shouldn't gleefully decree "you lose! You mentioned Nazis!" with clinging to that stupid insipid "law" as their excuse.



Anyway! What about characters who clearly *aren't* Nazis but have some trappings? Here I'm thinking of the ACROSS members and their salute, even though it's said flat out that Il Palazzo hates Nazis (and pretty much every other form of Earth government too, but he gets pretty riled when someone brings that up in particular). Hell, even Kaede (the character I cosplayed this year) salutes her boss with something that's commonly mistaken for that salute (even though honestly I've never seen a Nazi salute with the arm straight up...but a lot of people seem to think it's the same thing).

And yes, to go back to the initial subject, a hell of a lot more people know what Pyramid Head is and what he does than are familar with the exploits of Pedobear. Is it different because Pyramid Head goes after *adults*?

[TanisNikana]

I lost the game.

[XFD]

words

Well done! (You ran the gunz panel didn't you? )

I think if someone did the nazi gig it'd only be done because of the shock value.

Where do you keep getting this from? There are no COMPARASIONS to Nazis or facism any place in this thread, and THAT'S what Godwin's is. Not MENTIONING Nazis in a place where it's suitable to mention them!

Plus I'm sick of that "law" any way. Sometimes a comparasion *is* valid, and the other person shouldn't gleefully decree "you lose! You mentioned Nazis!" with clinging to that stupid insipid "law" as their excuse.

A way I get around most "ZOMG GODWINGODWINGODWINGODWINGODWIN" is to switch to Stalin-Russia. Quite a bit of the same garbage, different nation. The normies who would default to calling godwin go in to an infitie loop.

[Rathany]

A way I get around most "ZOMG GODWINGODWINGODWINGODWINGODWIN" is to switch to Stalin-Russia. Quite a bit of the same garbage, different nation. The normies who would default to calling godwin go in to an infitie loop.

Also, who can tell me what meme this is?

[Mod Edit - We are not going there.]

That is less well known and doesn't have the specific characteristics of PedoBear.  However, we are going going there.  If this thread starts getting into topics like that fetish I will LOCK this thread.  I am highly tempted to lock this overnight and unlock it when I can babysit it in the morning. 

[Rathany]

A way I get around most "ZOMG GODWINGODWINGODWINGODWINGODWIN" is to switch to Stalin-Russia. Quite a bit of the same garbage, different nation. The normies who would default to calling godwin go in to an infitie loop.

Also, who can tell me what meme this is?

[Mod Edit - We are not going there.]

That is less well known and doesn't have the specific characteristics of PedoBear.  However, we are not going there.  If this thread starts getting into topics like that fetish I will LOCK this thread.  I am highly tempted to lock this overnight and unlock it when I can babysit it in the morning. 

[Ayumu]

Kumoricon is a private organization and can ban whatever it wants. This includes Pedobear, scantily-clad cosplayers, and peanut butter and jelly sandwiches between the hours of 3:14 pm and 7:09 pm. It doesn't matter WHY or how much you disagree. It is what it is, so stop having a fit over it.

[MistressLegato]

Amen.  The pedobear thing is WAY over.  It won't EVER be allowed in most places.

Again, on the Nazi thing, I don't really care how UNOFFENDED people are, there are those of us who are DEEPLY offended with Jewish roots and I think, however selfish it sounds, that that's more important.

You wouldn't go around shouting the N word because it doesn't personally offend you because it offends those around you.

'Nuff said.

[BlackjackGabbiani]

there are those of us who are DEEPLY offended with Jewish roots

And, y'know, everyone ELSE too. People tend to forget that Jews weren't the only victims.

[TanisNikana]

there are those of us who are DEEPLY offended with Jewish roots

And, y'know, everyone ELSE too. People tend to forget that Jews weren't the only victims.

Us handicapped and gay folk, two things that Hitler would have had my nuts for, were also popular targets at the time.

Thankfully I'm not a gypsy.

[Prinz Eugen]

there are those of us who are DEEPLY offended with Jewish roots

And, y'know, everyone ELSE too. People tend to forget that Jews weren't the only victims.

Good reminders. Especialy the take on our 'buddy' Stalin.
Read 'The Gulag Archepelago' to learn how much FUN he was.
Also, my wife is of Lithuanian descent, and if you know about the Rippentrop deal, plus Stalin's purges in the 1940s - about 1/4 or her family were killed outright or carted off to Siberia by rail. *NOT* good times.

- G

[ZombieFace]

Umm. The PedoBear discussion was over a while ago. I see why people go into Nazis and such when it comes to banning things. WHY NOT NAZIS instead of cute bears! and such..
But, back on topic, does anybody remember any costumes that were not allowed from previous years?
Also, this is becoming very heated and dramatic which is not the intent.  I am hoping that this all will help con goers, who go to the forums, define the line that Kumoricon has but does not particularly speak of.
It is a PG13 con.. yet Hentai and R Rated cosplay is allowed.  If you say that, "Well, it's just a costume. It's not as if the cosplayer will act the same as the character.", then i believe I deserve some apologies from some of the people on this thread for calling me names for wanting to wear a PedoBear costume.
I'm sure in just a couple moments you can come up with many different outfits that are from series beyond PG13 that you have seen at KumoriCon.
I fine example of a cosplay that was allowed but not threatened was Panty Thief Happosai, cosplayed by the infamous Chris - formally of Baka Zoku.  With many under 18 teens running around scantily clad most of the time, you'd think KCon would have something to say about this. 

Pic Below is of Panty Thief Happosai

[XFD]

That is less well known and doesn't have the specific characteristics of PedoBear.  However, we are going going there.  If this thread starts getting into topics like that fetish I will LOCK this thread.  I am highly tempted to lock this overnight and unlock it when I can babysit it in the morning. 

The fact that someone knew what that was makes me happy on countless levels; it won't just be the retarded memes, it'll be the genuinely ****** up memes that get the boot too.

[LtCommanderRichie]

And yet Horse Man didn't get the boot? That costume was, according to my lunch lady (who knows the guy under the mask, small world huh?) originally supposed to be PonyStalker of 4chan fame. I understand that Pedobear should/could/had better be friggin' banned, but then why not put the boot on all the animal-themed 4chan memes? They're all just as bad. As XFD said, some of those things can be seriously freaking wierd, disgusting and overall just not child-appropriate.

[Rathany]

And yet Horse Man didn't get the boot? That costume was, according to my lunch lady (who knows the guy under the mask, small world huh?) originally supposed to be PonyStalker of 4chan fame. I understand that Pedobear should/could/had better be friggin' banned, but then why not put the boot on all the animal-themed 4chan memes? They're all just as bad. As XFD said, some of those things can be seriously freaking wierd, disgusting and overall just not child-appropriate.

From Google Image Search:

"Your search - PonyStalker - did not match any documents."

From regular google:

The first result in English gets me this: result.

Either this is ridiculously obscure, or someone was incorrect. 

[XFD]

Didn't someone mention that he was from FMP Fumoffu?

[Teuvan]

And yet Horse Man didn't get the boot? That costume was, according to my lunch lady (who knows the guy under the mask, small world huh?) originally supposed to be PonyStalker of 4chan fame. I understand that Pedobear should/could/had better be friggin' banned, but then why not put the boot on all the animal-themed 4chan memes? They're all just as bad. As XFD said, some of those things can be seriously freaking wierd, disgusting and overall just not child-appropriate.

He's from Full Metal Panic Fumoffu, as a mysterious stalker who's obsessed with ponytails.

[LtCommanderRichie]

Hmm, I could have sworn that the stalker animal meme was PonyStalker... Alright, thank you! Slight faux pas on my part.

Either way, why not ban all of the particularly infamous memes? Not anything like the Rickroll or loosing the game, but the really terrible ones.

Although that makes me wonder how someone would go about doing a 50 Hitler post IRL. The question still stands, though!

[Teuvan]

Hmm, I could have sworn that the stalker animal meme was PonyStalker... Alright, thank you! Slight faux pas on my part.

Either way, why not ban all of the particularly infamous memes? Not anything like the Rickroll or loosing the game, but the really terrible ones.

Although that makes me wonder how someone would go about doing a 50 Hitler post IRL. The question still stands, though!

I would be much more in favor of banning annoying crap like Rickrolling and losing the game. Anyway, exactly who's to decide what qualifies as "really terrible," anyway? And if we're going to worry so thoroughly about potentially offended anyone, why not ban cosplay of really terrible villains? I mean, we have lots of people dressed as murders, dictators, characters responsible for genocide, and so on. I mean, certainly all those Kira's and Aizen's and Sins have done worse things than a cartoon bear. What's the difference between a fictional character spawned from the Internet, and a fictional character spawned from an anime? Hell, let's make things simple, and only allow cosplay of characters from Love Hina. But no Naru; she's too violent. And nothing revealing; everyone has to wear parkas. But we'll still know it's Love Hina, right?

[LtCommanderRichie]

Then why not ban cosplay all together? The point is, there will always be something that offends someone. I get that. But more often than not unless the person knows the series inside and out, they won't look at King Bradley and say that he's responsible for genocide, or Kira for the same thing, they'll just see yet another person in a blue military uniform or a kid with a notebook. Yes the Organization XIII stands for taking the hearts of millions, yes the Order of the Millenium or whatever from Hellsing is a Neo-Nazi organization... But will someone who might otherwise take offense to the ideals behind the costume actually recognize the costume as what it is, then recognize the ideals?

Taking offense depends on the subject matter that any one person is already familiar with. I'm saying, though, on the subject of the terrible memes, to ban the animals that stand for pedophilia and beastiality and all those other non-family-friendly things that people will yell out the names of in the middle of con when they see them.

[MistressLegato]

Please don't be ridiculous and suggest that Kira is as offensive as a Stalin or Hitler costume.  Kira isn't a real murderer, or even a real person.

The pedobear thing is because he promotes the molestation of children.  You'd be out of your mind to think that it should be allowed at a con with children.

Can we please be serious?

[BlackjackGabbiani]

Except that Pedobear is *also* not a real person (or real bear).

[SpearXXI]

Except that Pedobear is *also* not a real person (or real bear).

I thought Pedobear was meant to be an insensitive joke about pedophilia, and Kira was created for a story. Some jokes are better left unsaid depending on the crowd or target audience. Having someone dress up as the Pedobear is not PG-13, which is what Kumoricon wants their con to be. It's just like you won't see dead baby or racist jokes in a pixar movie, because that would be a huge Rubicon, and would not be a good idea. Sure, in certain situations the jokes may be funny, but that does not excuse the joke to be said anywhere/anytime. *shrug*

[~boogiepop~]

And yet Horse Man didn't get the boot? That costume was, according to my lunch lady (who knows the guy under the mask, small world huh?) originally supposed to be PonyStalker of 4chan fame. I understand that Pedobear should/could/had better be friggin' banned, but then why not put the boot on all the animal-themed 4chan memes? They're all just as bad. As XFD said, some of those things can be seriously freaking wierd, disgusting and overall just not child-appropriate.

I just assumed he was imitating the skit Tom Green did with the horse head. That had never even crossed my mind and I'm an avid 4channer.

EDIT: And you guys are getting a little ridiculous. I agree with MistressLagato. Very people may find that cosplaying from Kingdom Hearts or Deathnote is offensive but the anime is being broadcasted on television and the games are getting sold in stores. The cosplays that were talked about earlier aren't being put out to the general public and you have to go searching for it on the internet to figure out what's going on.